2A Region 4 Know your rules
05/03/2021 2:34:08 PM
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At our region meet on Saturday during the boys 4x8 my anchor leg was told before the final exchange that he had to remove his headband or he had to get off the track by the BCAA officials and the meet director. My athlete has worn this headband all year and was aware because I have told him, that it was perfectly legal to wear this headband. My athlete did take off his headband and I'm sure it had some psychological effect on his race. As I knew this was not a rule anymore I made it evident to the officials and the meet director before finals by showing them the FHSAA manual myself on my phone. I was still told that he could not wear his headband. After further review, it was made clear that the meet director had in his meet packet information "No headbands" all though the FHSAA has clearly not had this rule anymore. So because the meet director had this in his non FHSAA meet packet the officials were going by this even though I stated "We are to comply by the FHSAA's mandated rules not the meet directors, for all we know the meet director could make a rule that 4 teams were to qualify out but that is not the case because we must follow the rules in place by the FHSAA." After even more discussion and the contacting of Ed Thompson, the meet director then finally gave me the green light for my athlete to wear his headband for finals. He then went on to run 1:58 and qualify to the state meet with ease as a runner up. This post serves to show that it's important you KNOW your rules as a coach and meet director. I may be a 22 year old coach but I was well aware of this rule and made it a point to get my athlete the confidence he needs to race. How it effected our boys 4x8 who were 2 seconds off qualifying to state will never be known. Know your rules and fight for your athletes because some people still don't know the rules. Coach David Suarez Gulliver Prep
At our region meet on Saturday during the boys 4x8 my anchor leg was told before the final exchange that he had to remove his headband or he had to get off the track by the BCAA officials and the meet director. My athlete has worn this headband all year and was aware because I have told him, that it was perfectly legal to wear this headband. My athlete did take off his headband and I'm sure it had some psychological effect on his race. As I knew this was not a rule anymore I made it evident to the officials and the meet director before finals by showing them the FHSAA manual myself on my phone. I was still told that he could not wear his headband. After further review, it was made clear that the meet director had in his meet packet information "No headbands" all though the FHSAA has clearly not had this rule anymore. So because the meet director had this in his non FHSAA meet packet the officials were going by this even though I stated "We are to comply by the FHSAA's mandated rules not the meet directors, for all we know the meet director could make a rule that 4 teams were to qualify out but that is not the case because we must follow the rules in place by the FHSAA." After even more discussion and the contacting of Ed Thompson, the meet director then finally gave me the green light for my athlete to wear his headband for finals. He then went on to run 1:58 and qualify to the state meet with ease as a runner up. This post serves to show that it's important you KNOW your rules as a coach and meet director. I may be a 22 year old coach but I was well aware of this rule and made it a point to get my athlete the confidence he needs to race. How it effected our boys 4x8 who were 2 seconds off qualifying to state will never be known. Know your rules and fight for your athletes because some people still don't know the rules.

Coach David Suarez
Gulliver Prep
05/03/2021 6:04:26 PM
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Don't get me started on 2A Region 1!! . . . by the end of track season even the most clueless runners on our team know that the fastest two seeds in the distance events don't share LANE ONE at the starting line (and especially not at the start of a 4 x 800 relay or an 800m and especially not in a championship event). And I'm pretty sure that they also know that you don't have a waterfall start in the 1600m when you have 16 or less runners. **and when the Region schedule says the 800m starts at 6 pm, coaches should not have to make multiple trips to the starter/meet official/press box announcer to explain/argue why it should not start at 5:40 pm.
Don't get me started on 2A Region 1!! . . . by the end of track season even the most clueless runners on our team know that the fastest two seeds in the distance events don't share LANE ONE at the starting line (and especially not at the start of a 4 x 800 relay or an 800m and especially not in a championship event). And I'm pretty sure that they also know that you don't have a waterfall start in the 1600m when you have 16 or less runners.
**and when the Region schedule says the 800m starts at 6 pm, coaches should not have to make multiple trips to the starter/meet official/press box announcer to explain/argue why it should not start at 5:40 pm.
05/03/2021 6:46:13 PM
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@vantheman1984 Kinda like 3A region 3 finishing over 90 min ahead of the other regions...And the 3200m went off about 20 degrees hotter than probably each of the other regions on a race that advances by time.
@vantheman1984
Kinda like 3A region 3 finishing over 90 min ahead of the other regions...And the 3200m went off about 20 degrees hotter than probably each of the other regions on a race that advances by time.
05/03/2021 7:04:53 PM
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@vantheman1984 2A Region 3 wasn’t supplied blocks for the 4x4. Don’t get me started on that mess. No announcing of events (what event are we even on? Who’s in it? Who won?). We had a jump off for pole vault before the champion was done vaulting. On and on. Really disappointing experience for every single one of my athletes who were first time regional competitors to have THAT be their experience. However, putting (almost) all of the regions on the same day, how the heck are you supposed to get adequate officials? I get the year of covid, but it just feels like a continual slap in the face from our governing body. Just look at the 1a/2a state schedule and it’s obvious this hasn’t been an athlete-centered season.
@vantheman1984

2A Region 3 wasn't supplied blocks for the 4x4. Don't get me started on that mess. No announcing of events (what event are we even on? Who's in it? Who won?). We had a jump off for pole vault before the champion was done vaulting. On and on. Really disappointing experience for every single one of my athletes who were first time regional competitors to have THAT be their experience.

However, putting (almost) all of the regions on the same day, how the heck are you supposed to get adequate officials? I get the year of covid, but it just feels like a continual slap in the face from our governing body. Just look at the 1a/2a state schedule and it's obvious this hasn't been an athlete-centered season.
05/03/2021 7:07:18 PM
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@raycer131 I know I’m not popular with this ... but another example why at large bids are not fair.
@raycer131

I know I'm not popular with this ... but another example why at large bids are not fair.
05/03/2021 7:26:11 PM
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Much rather see a season-long qualifying list rather than this silly (almost) every region qualifies same day under different conditions process. Might as well have just done top four auto-qualify for state this year. Eliminate district meets
Much rather see a season-long qualifying list rather than this silly (almost) every region qualifies same day under different conditions process. Might as well have just done top four auto-qualify for state this year. Eliminate district meets
05/03/2021 7:28:19 PM
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@Aholmes80 Hell yes
@Aholmes80

Hell yes
05/03/2021 8:15:04 PM
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@mbecker @aholmes80 Yes agreed In the "slow" 100m heat our kid runs 10.9 into a 3mph wind...wind flips for the "fast" heat and its 1mph wind aided and they go 10.6 to 10.8....literally 4 mph difference in the same region location. Imagine that across all 4 regions
@mbecker
@aholmes80
Yes agreed
In the "slow" 100m heat our kid runs 10.9 into a 3mph wind...wind flips for the "fast" heat and its 1mph wind aided and they go 10.6 to 10.8....literally 4 mph difference in the same region location. Imagine that across all 4 regions
05/03/2021 8:31:27 PM
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@raycer131 Raposo and i were the pariahs on this one At large bids are inherently unfair and take away something very tangible from the region meet qualification process In events decided by centimeters and hundredths of seconds it’s ridiculous to compare
@raycer131

Raposo and i were the pariahs on this one
At large bids are inherently unfair and take away something very tangible from the region meet qualification process

In events decided by centimeters and hundredths of seconds it's ridiculous to compare
05/03/2021 11:04:40 PM
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@mbecker Well said. I have NEVER seen a state series more poorly organized, officiated, or (non)informative for coaches. NO slight to our region meet host, who did a great job after last minute requests to host from the FHSAA! I am referring to all the slight changes and gray areas to the rules based on whether Ed Thompson feels one way or another at that given moment.... Our officiating staff also said no headbands.....so happy we are involved in a sport where regular season and post season are never farther apart. It's embarrassing and only one person to blame.... I've tried the political approach. That ain't working! It's either who you know or what your name is...SO DONE. We are all working our asses off to support T&F in FL, with no support from the FHSAA. Either you are building confidence in the system and support from the lower ranks...or, well, you aren't. Message received.
@mbecker

Well said. I have NEVER seen a state series more poorly organized, officiated, or (non)informative for coaches. NO slight to our region meet host, who did a great job after last minute requests to host from the FHSAA! I am referring to all the slight changes and gray areas to the rules based on whether Ed Thompson feels one way or another at that given moment....

Our officiating staff also said no headbands.....so happy we are involved in a sport where regular season and post season are never farther apart. It's embarrassing and only one person to blame....

I've tried the political approach. That ain't working! It's either who you know or what your name is...SO DONE. We are all working our asses off to support T&F in FL, with no support from the FHSAA.

Either you are building confidence in the system and support from the lower ranks...or, well, you aren't. Message received.
05/04/2021 7:03:15 AM
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Back to Region 4 AA Nothing is perfect... however Paul Baur and Cavalry did a great job overall imo. Kids, coaches and officials were totally green to the state series after a two year lay off. The few officials still working in South Florida had to be shared with other regions the same weekend. There were dozens of coaches who had not been to a regional before. Head coaches were asking me questions like " which side of the long jump board do we measure from ?" and why is the 400 meter relay passing zone so big?". Having run that regional event several times, I can assure the critics that they could not have run this mega event better. This year was a year like no other. Just look at the 16th qualifying mark in most events and the drop offs are clear. The drop off and frustrations are hopefully to be short lived. Its gonna take a year or so to teach kids how to participate in a track meet, re orient new coaches, and get the officials back where they were in 2019. Its why I have a big asterisk at every turn. One more week of confusion and stress... then here's to 2022
Back to Region 4 AA

Nothing is perfect... however Paul Baur and Cavalry did a great job overall imo. Kids, coaches and officials were totally green to the state series after a two year lay off. The few officials still working in South Florida had to be shared with other regions the same weekend. There were dozens of coaches who had not been to a regional before. Head coaches were asking me questions like " which side of the long jump board do we measure from ?" and why is the 400 meter relay passing zone so big?". Having run that regional event several times, I can assure the critics that they could not have run this mega event better.

This year was a year like no other. Just look at the 16th qualifying mark in most events and the drop offs are clear. The drop off and frustrations are hopefully to be short lived. Its gonna take a year or so to teach kids how to participate in a track meet, re orient new coaches, and get the officials back where they were in 2019. Its why I have a big asterisk at every turn. One more week of confusion and stress... then here's to 2022
05/04/2021 10:15:59 PM
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@GulliverRaiders Great job knowing your rules and calling people out, David. This coming from a veteran loudmouthed know-it-all. Lol [quote=mbecker]Raposo and i were the pariahs on this one At large bids are inherently unfair and take away something very tangible from the region meet qualification process In events decided by centimeters and hundredths of seconds it’s ridiculous to compare [/quote] @mbecker I'm still with you, Mike. Nothing can replace head to head competition in our sports which is determined by inches or fractions of a second. That being said, for the final 4A Girls 200m at-large qualifier, we were actually requested to break a tie to the .001, to compare against a girl from another Region. Sigh...
@GulliverRaiders Great job knowing your rules and calling people out, David. This coming from a veteran loudmouthed know-it-all. Lol

mbecker wrote:
Raposo and i were the pariahs on this one
At large bids are inherently unfair and take away something very tangible from the region meet qualification process

In events decided by centimeters and hundredths of seconds it's ridiculous to compare

@mbecker I'm still with you, Mike. Nothing can replace head to head competition in our sports which is determined by inches or fractions of a second.

That being said, for the final 4A Girls 200m at-large qualifier, we were actually requested to break a tie to the .001, to compare against a girl from another Region. Sigh...
05/05/2021 7:36:04 AM
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@GulliverRaiders However..... from the State meet Participant instructions: "BANDANAS, DO-RAGS, AND OTHER ADORNED HEADBAND-TYPE WEAR ARE PROHIBITED". Could we be a little more vague? Does that mean no headbands, or no adorned headbands? Or nothing that's kind of like a headband?
@GulliverRaiders
However..... from the State meet Participant instructions:

"BANDANAS, DO-RAGS, AND OTHER ADORNED HEADBAND-TYPE WEAR ARE PROHIBITED".

Could we be a little more vague? Does that mean no headbands, or no adorned headbands? Or nothing that's kind of like a headband?
05/05/2021 7:48:17 AM
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@francee A Regular Headbands is ok Adorned meaning no beads or hard objects on it is my understanding... but yes very vague indeed...
@francee

A Regular Headbands is ok
Adorned meaning no beads or hard objects on it is my understanding... but yes very vague indeed...
05/05/2021 7:49:23 AM
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@raycer131 Ok- so if the headband has writing or a logo on it that's ok?
@raycer131
Ok- so if the headband has writing or a logo on it that's ok?
05/05/2021 8:42:22 AM
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@GulliverRaiders I believe since the mid 1990's (maybe even earlier), the NFHS rule book has allowed the wearing of headbands as long as they did not exceed a certain width. I believe FHSAA followed the NFHS rule back then too. Since the region meet is part of the FHSAA state series, then the meet director must follow the FHSAA rules. It is a shame that all the time and emotional energy was wasted in having to reveal something that has been in the "books" for years. What amazes me is that not a single official mentioned anything to the meet director (prior to the meet beginning) regarding the contradiction between the rule and what the meet director was trying to implement/enforce. This tells me the officials who worked that meet did not know the rule either....SCARY
@GulliverRaiders

I believe since the mid 1990's (maybe even earlier), the NFHS rule book has allowed the wearing of headbands as long as they did not exceed a certain width. I believe FHSAA followed the NFHS rule back then too. Since the region meet is part of the FHSAA state series, then the meet director must follow the FHSAA rules.

It is a shame that all the time and emotional energy was wasted in having to reveal something that has been in the "books" for years. What amazes me is that not a single official mentioned anything to the meet director (prior to the meet beginning) regarding the contradiction between the rule and what the meet director was trying to implement/enforce. This tells me the officials who worked that meet did not know the rule either....SCARY
05/05/2021 8:54:20 AM
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@francee Headband-Type probably refers to a bandana that is rolled up and warn like a headband. There is probably some specification on the allowable size of the logo...
@francee

Headband-Type probably refers to a bandana that is rolled up and warn like a headband.

There is probably some specification on the allowable size of the logo...
05/05/2021 9:19:57 AM
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I get restricting the logo and writing on the garments, but can anyone explain why this even needs to be a rule?
I get restricting the logo and writing on the garments, but can anyone explain why this even needs to be a rule?
05/05/2021 10:02:32 AM
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@mbecker I understand you but to play devil's advocate.....I remember regions one season when one region in the Boys 4x100 had the 1st 6 fastest times ran out of the four regions. Two of those teams couldn't go to state, 1 was sub 42 seconds. But the state meet did have a couple of schools running 43 seconds because their region wasn't as strong in the 4x100.
@mbecker

I understand you but to play devil's advocate.....I remember regions one season when one region in the Boys 4x100 had the 1st 6 fastest times ran out of the four regions. Two of those teams couldn't go to state, 1 was sub 42 seconds. But the state meet did have a couple of schools running 43 seconds because their region wasn't as strong in the 4x100.
05/05/2021 10:12:57 AM
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If someone could also explain why at Districts, nobody cared that some girls wore spandex shorts with the "Nike Pro" label on them, but at Regions they were threatened with a DQ? Also, the meet director announced that coaches were allowed on the infield yet i was yelled at by the starter during the 4x800. I know the rules, and these are in fact both not allowed, so why the contradiction?
If someone could also explain why at Districts, nobody cared that some girls wore spandex shorts with the "Nike Pro" label on them, but at Regions they were threatened with a DQ?
Also, the meet director announced that coaches were allowed on the infield yet i was yelled at by the starter during the 4x800.
I know the rules, and these are in fact both not allowed, so why the contradiction?

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